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chuckbaldwin wrote:Hi Arnold,
Since a new calendar was instituted in Ex.12, from then on the ecclestiastical days were even-to-even. My main argument is that the CREATION days were dawn-to-dawn.
But there are also many passages that refer to the natural day. If you check out all the uses of the word "[to]morrow" (meaning the "next day"), you'll find that they all refer to the following morning, not "this evening".
Hi Kickme,kickme wrote:BTW, from the beginning time was listed as evening and morning being the 1st, 2nd, etc day. How hard is that to comprehend anyway?
Hi Matthew,ErichMatthewJanzen wrote:Shalom, Chuck,
You had posted previously about defining darkness, and I would like to give you my understanding.
I believe I have shown from Psalm 30:5 and Job 7:3-4 that the word ereb can apply to a time period well into the night. However, I also believe that ereb can apply to a time period anytime after the sun begins to go down. In other words, the sun begins to rise at daybreak or dawn and continues to rise until midday. After this the sun begins to go down and continues to go down until dark - when the stars appear.
I believe Jeremiah 6:4 shows that this time period can be referred to as evening:
"Set them apart for war against her; rise up, let's attack at noon. Woe to us for the day is passing; the evening shadows grow long. rise up, let's attack in the night. Let us destroy her fortresses." [Holman Christian Standard Bible - HCSB]
I can't be dogmatic, but my idea of "coming" & "going" of the sun is based on the premise that when we can see the sun, it is here. When it 1st appears at sunrise is when it "comes", and when it disappears at sunset, it "goes". Therefore the "going of the sun" would in fact be sunset. Just my view.I believe this is also seen in Deuteronomy 16:6 were the command is given to sacrifice the Passover at even (ereb) at the going of the sun. I have purposely removed the word "down" in the phrase "going (down) of the sun" because there is no underlying Hebrew word for down in any of the passages that speak of the "going of the sun". Therefore "sunset" as we think of it is technically not in the Bible. The going of the sun is the opposite of the coming of the sun. Seeing that the coming of the sun begins at daybreak and continues till midday, the going of the sun begins after midday and continues till night. I believe this second period can be referred to as ereb.
I agree theoretically, but i would challenge you to stand outside with me "between the evenings" ([evening] twilight - NKJV), and tell me the precise instant when the stars "turn on" and it becomes "night".How do we know when darkness is? This is a logical question seeing that darkness progresses all the way until midnight. An excellent determiner would be the light of the stars. ... the men would work during the day and cease at night. The passage also says they would work all day until the stars came out. The words "night" and "until the stars came out" are used interchangeably. Thus the light of the stars was a visible divider between day and night.
chuckbaldwin wrote:ErichMatthewJanzen wrote:Shalom, Chuck,
You had posted previously about defining darkness, and I would like to give you my understanding.
I believe I have shown from Psalm 30:5 and Job 7:3-4 that the word ereb can apply to a time period well into the night. However, I also believe that ereb can apply to a time period anytime after the sun begins to go down. In other words, the sun begins to rise at daybreak or dawn and continues to rise until midday. After this the sun begins to go down and continues to go down until dark - when the stars appear.
I believe Jeremiah 6:4 shows that this time period can be referred to as evening:
"Set them apart for war against her; rise up, let's attack at noon. Woe to us for the day is passing; the evening shadows grow long. rise up, let's attack in the night. Let us destroy her fortresses." [Holman Christian Standard Bible - HCSB]
chuckbaldwin wrote:It's easy enough to comprehend, but it's WRONG. It's even easier to comprehend what the Hebrew text says, which is NOT what the KJV says. Just see one of my previous posts on the subject. The Gen.1 creation days (day 2 - day 6) started & ended at DAWN (morning/boqer).
kickme wrote:chuckbaldwin wrote:It's easy enough to comprehend, but it's WRONG. It's even easier to comprehend what the Hebrew text says, which is NOT what the KJV says. Just see one of my previous posts on the subject. The Gen.1 creation days (day 2 - day 6) started & ended at DAWN (morning/boqer).
Ok, I'm not quite sure how to answer that as every translation I can find lists the day evening and morning.
Here's what I have:
Are you saying that every translation I've ever read was wrong on this?
You are mistaken. The original "darkness" was not "ereb", it was "choshek". Just thought i'd point that out.BrotherArnold wrote:I also believe even though the word ereb can apply to different periods of time, the original meaning of the word itself has not changed since Genesis one. i.e. The darkness (ereb) that was upon the earth.
I already did this, but sometimes you seem to ignore posts that you don't have an answer for, so i'll re-state the one i refer to:I challenge anyone to show where the word itself cannot be referring to darkness...
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