kathybyers2000 wrote:Greetings all.
Hope you are all doing well on this fine day that YHWH has made.
Would anybody like to discuss John chapter 20 where the ladies go early the first of the week to the sepulchre and later in that chapter it is noted that in the evening (still the first of the week) he came to his disciples.
This chapter, along with the day of atonement instruction, are what has shown my heart a new understanding regarding rendering time.
Shalom Sister Kathy,
I will spend a little time at it but not too much because I am getting behind on my responses but believe I can give a answer to it but woulld like to see what kind of an answer there is for some of my questions such as the following one.
It Is "Impossible" To Have A 3rd Day Resurrection if you believe the sunrise theory and the Scripture clearly teaches He must rise the third day.
Here is something to consider for those who believe the day begins at sunrise or only begins in the morning and consists only of 12 hours. We agree that one definition (the narrow) of the word "Day" consists of only 12 hours, but when this same word is studied in different contexts in the totality of Scripture we see it can have several meanings.
Our Messiah died on the 14th of Aviv, the same day the Passover lambs had been slaughtered for centuries prior to his death. For those who reckon the day from sunrise to sunrise, the Messiah died on the 14th of Aviv and then the evening of the 14th came afterwards, with the weekly Sabbath beginning the morning of the 15th at sunrise. This poses a serious problem when it comes to the resurrection day of the Messiah. If the 1st day of the week will not begin until the sunrise of the 16th of Aviv, and then the Messiah would have resurrected BEFORE sunrise on the SECOND day, instead of the 3rd day.
All the gospel accounts agree that when the women came to the tomb it was very early in the morning, and the gospel according to John (20th chapter) tells us this occurred "While it was yet dark" (KJV). How can it be then that the Messiah rose the 3RD DAY ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURES if He rose before the 3rd day began????
The day of his death (14th) would be day one, and the day of the Sabbath (15th) would be day two, and day three would not begin until sunrise of the 16th for the sunrise to sunrise proponents. This means it is an impossibility for this theology to align its understanding with what the Bible teaches about the third day resurrection predicted by the Messiah himself over 10 times and corroborated by the Apostle Shaul in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
This is not to mention that this teaching also has the Messiah rising on the Sabbath, rather than the 1st day of the week; a teaching that shows similarity with 72 hour proponents. The Scriptures make it very clear that the sheaf of first-fruits (barley) was to be waved on the MORROW AFTER THE SABBATH (Lev. 23:10-16), and NOT on the Sabbath itself. A sunrise to sunrise view has our Messiah resurrected on the Sabbath (2nd day) instead of the morrow after the Sabbath (3rd day) as the Scripture teaches.
In closing, we must also mention that for those espousing a 12 hour Sabbath, one which begins at morning and ends at dusk, has the Messiah rising on a NON-DAY, during the night. This teaching has the Messiah not rising on the Sabbath OR the first day of the week (the 3rd day, 16th), but on what they consider to not be a day at all. The 12 noon people have the same problems.
The Scriptures will all harmonize if we can only see that the word "Day" in Scripture has a broader definition, and not only one narrow definition of the daylight hours. With an evening to evening day, which the Bible clearly teaches (Gen. 1:5;Ex. 12:17; Lev. 23:32) the Messiah can be impaled on the 14th, rest on the Sabbath for the entire 15th day, and as the next day begins (the evening of the 16th) he resurrects (ready to work) before morning, but yet still on the 3rd day " according to the Scriptures (1 Cor. 15:1-4) " on the morrow after the Sabbath (Lev. 23:10-16).
PS. Some may object to our line of reasoning by saying that the Messiah resurrected the split second the daylight hours began on the 16th, but this is unsound for the following reason(s). All four gospel accounts agree that the women came to the tomb very early in the morning, with John's gospel elaborating a bit further that this was while it was yet dark, and another says, as it began to dawn toward the 1st day of the week. All gospel accounts show that the women were amazed that he was not there, and as the angelic messenger(s) proclaimed "HE IS NOT HERE, HE HAS RISEN. This proves beyond doubt that our Messiah had already risen prior to the daylight hours, but yet, as noted above, this was still on the 3rd day according to the evening to evening view, but the 2nd day according to the sunrise or 12 noon view.
We see from the above that the sunrise proponents can NOT have a third day resurrection and this alone kills the sunrise doctrine.