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Tips on Pumping Gas

Posted: 22 May 2008, 17:52
by Lambchop
I wasn't sure where to put this e-mail I recieved, so it landed here.
What is being said in this e-mail is very true. I have dealt in the past with oil companies, and these are good tips for this day and time when gas cost are so high.


I don't know what you guys are paying for gasoline.... But here in
California we are also paying higher, up to $4.00 per gallon. But my
line of work is in petroleum for about 31 years now, so here are some
tricks to get more of your money's worth for every gallon.

Here at the Kinder Morgan Pipeline where I work in San Jose , CA we
deliver about 4 million gallons in a 24-hour period thru the pipeline.
One day is diesel the next day is jet fuel, and gasoline, regular and
prem ium grades. We have 34-storage tanks here with a total capacity
of 16,800,000 gallons.

Only buy or fill up your car or truck in the early morning when the
ground temperature is still cold. Remember that all service stations
have their storage tanks buried below ground. The colder the ground the
more dense the gasoline, when it gets warmer gasoline expands, so
buying in the afternoon or in the evening....your gallon is not exactly a
gallon. In the petroleum business, the specific gravity and the
temperature of the gasoline, diesel and jet fuel, ethanol and other
petroleum products plays an important role.

A 1-degree rise in temperature is a big deal for this business. But the
service stations do not have temperature compensation at the pumps.

When you're filling up do not squeeze the trigger of the nozzle to a
fast mode. If you look you will see that the trigger has three (3)
stages: low, middle, and high. You should be pumping on low speed,
thereby minimizing the vapors that are created while you are pumping.
All hoses at the pump have a vapor return. If you are pumping on the
fast rate, some other liquid that goes to your tank becomes vapor.
Those vapors are being sucked up and back into the underground storage tank
so you're getting less worth for your money.

One of the most important tips is to fill up when your gas tank is HALF
FULL or HALF EMPTY. The reason for this is, the more gas you have in
your tank the less air occupying its empty space. Gasoline evaporates
faster than you can imagine. Gasoline storage tanks have an internal
floating roof. This roof serves as zero clearance between the gas and
the atmosphere, so it minimizes the evaporation. Unlike service
stations, here where I work, every truck that we load is temperature
compensated so that every gallon is actually the exact amount.

Another reminder, if there is a gasoline truck pumping into the storage
tanks when you stop to buy gas, DO NOT fill up--most likely the
gasoline is being stirred up as the gas is being delivered, and you might pick
up some of the dirt that normally settles on the bottom. Hope this will
help you get the most value for your money.


Posted: 23 May 2008, 08:48
by chosen
how can the gas evaporate in a sealed car's gas tank? do the gas vapors escape out the hole where the gas goes into the gas tank?

thanks for the tips.

just wondering,


Posted: 23 May 2008, 10:49
by HeHoldsMyHand
Maybe I can make my American friends feel a bit better when I tell you that us Brits are paying the equivalent of $8 a gallon! My husband's diesel saloon car now takes $120 to fill the tank. It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for the fact that 67% goes on tax. We save money by not going out so much!

Posted: 23 May 2008, 12:20
by chosen
couldn't you just live in the car........ it is after all a "saloon" car. that would save you bunches in expenses right there!

saloon - 1728, Anglicized form of salon (q.v.), and originally used interchangeable with it. Meaning large hall in a public place (esp. a passenger boat) is from c.1835, also used of railway cars furnished like drawing rooms. Sense of "public bar" developed by 1841, Amer.Eng.


i knew you lot in europe paid out the nose for gas, but i hadn't realized it was up to $8 a gal!!! and 67% is tax, what do you get for that? red tape!



Posted: 23 May 2008, 15:10
by Lambchop
Here in this small country town by us, we have seen people riding horses into town. A man in Sears told me that there's a man that parked his truck, and is now riding his riding lawn mower to the store.
These tips are things the oil tycoons doesn't want people to know. At they talk about these things they don't want the population of people to know.

Yes Chosen, the vapors comes out the hole where you put gas in. Have you ever removed your gas cap and heard a sound as if air had just been let out ?
Its also smart to add a gas additive to your tank every few fill ups, as the condensation builds up and produces sweat which is none other then H2O, which can make your car run slugglish. This mainly happens in the summer time, and trust me it is HOT here in Texas and summer hasn't even began :?

Posted: 24 May 2008, 14:25
by Lambchop
At 60 degrees a gallon is 231 cubic inches. But when the fuel is warmer then 60 degrees, the liquid expands, yielding less energy per gallon. When its colder, fuel contrast.
So basically what this means, is in the middle of the day when we gas up, we are getting less liquid then what the pump says.
Here's an interesting article.

Hot Fuel Adds To Cost Of U.S. Summer Gasoline
By Janet McGurty, REUTERS

May 22, 2008

NEW YORK, NY -- As if paying $4 a gallon isn't bad enough, U.S. drivers will soon face another gasoline price burden as the summer heat dilutes the amount of driving power delivered per gallon, industry watchdogs said on Thursday.
Drivers in most parts of the U.S. will likely get less energy than they pay for because fuel pumps at gas stations are unable to adjust prices to take into account the fuel volume changes caused by hot summer temperatures, they said.

"A 'hot fuel' surcharge of up a dime a gallon is concealed from motorists because they have no way to tell if the fuel they are buying is 60 degrees, 90 degrees or more," said Judy Dugan, research director of nonprofit Consumer Watchdog.

Gasoline is sold by volume, but as outside temperatures climb storage tanks heat up and fuel volume expands. That dilutes the amount of energy delivered per gallon, accounting for an extra $1.60 for each 20-gallon fill-up at 90 degrees based on current prices.

"It's the equivalent of the grocer putting his finger on the scale," said Dugan, who advocates legislation of requiring retail pumps to account for the temperature.

As mandated by law, retailers buy fuel from
wholesalers by volume at 60 degrees Fahrenheit. But there is no requirement for the temperature at which they have to sell it.

"Adjusting fuel price to temperature is a matter of simple fairness," said Joan Claybrook, president of Public Citizen.

Technology to monitor temperature at pumps has been used for decades in Canada, where the oil industry pushed for the law.

Conversely, in the United States, consumer watchdogs say the oil industry has lobbied against such a measure despite record high earnings and the relatively modest cost of $800 to modify an existing pump.

"Oil companies say 3, 5 cents more doesn't matter. But most motorists will cross the road to pay 5 cents a gallon less," said Consumer Watchdog's Dugan.

The nation's leading advocate for independent truckers, the Owner Operator Independent Drivers Association (OOIDA), is protesting the high cost of diesel fuel with several individual truckers taking to the courts their complaints about what they call a hidden subsidy.

A Federal District Court judge in Kansas City in February refused to dismiss the lawsuit. Legislation requiring temperature compensation was introduced in August 2007 by Senator Claire McCaskill.

"The hot fuel scam costs our members at least hundreds of dollars per year," said John Siebert of OOIDA. "Most of the rise in the price of groceries is because of the transportation costs," he said. "It's across the economy. It's something we are all paying for."

Posted: 24 May 2008, 16:43
by chosen

Posted: 25 May 2008, 02:02
by Chayil_Ishshah

I was reading through that...

I noticed this:

Assuming that a motorist typically bought 15 gallons of gasoline per week at $4.00 per gallon, and assuming that by carefully choosing to fill up at a particular time of day said consumer could realize a 1% savings, we calculate the total savings to be gleaned over the course of a year to be about $31.00. Would that reward really be worth the potential inconvenience of adhering to a rigid fill-up schedule week after week?

Hmmm. Whose side are they on?

Think of this -

10 people do it = $310.00 less for Mr. Big Oil
100 people do it = $3100.00 less for Mr. Big Oil
1000 people do it = $31,000.00 less for Mr. Big Oil
10,000 people do it = $310,000.00 less for Mr. Big Oil
100,000 people do it = $3,100,000.00 less for Mr. Big Oil


1,000,000 people do it = $31,000,000.00 less for Mr. Big Oil

How many drivers are on the road? True, if it's one person doing it, it's a drop in the bucket, but there are 304,167,202 people in the united States; how many are driving?

Pop Clock

Just some thoughts-


Posted: 25 May 2008, 11:36
by chuckbaldwin
I may have missed the point of the quote above, but i didn't think it was about how much (or little) a million early-morning gas purchases would affect the oil companies.

I thought it was about the trade-off between saving $31.00 over a year vs the inconvenience of having to get up early in the morning once a week (or whatever frequency) on a regular basis, just to go and buy some "cold" gas.

Also, consider, if you fill up with cold gas in the morning, then it heats up and expands in the afternoon, it might overflow the tank, and you'd lose the money you thought you saved.

I guess the answer is to stop pumping when the tank is 90% full, but then how do you know when that is?

Posted: 26 May 2008, 05:14
by HeHoldsMyHand
Hey Chosen, that's a good idea! It IS a big car, but the swing doors make it draughty!

Posted: 26 May 2008, 05:37
by Chayil_Ishshah
....i suppose i'm too frugal. To me, $31.00 is a lot of money. It's a tank of gas! If i save a tank by filling up in the morning, if i save a tank by using a store card to get .07 off a gallon, if i save a tank by going to town once a week instead of two or three times, if i save a tank by carpooling, etc . . . then not only have i saved my husband's money, Mr. Big Oil will have less of a profit from us.

Maybe if everybody chipped in things could be different.

Maybe i'm a nonconformist.

Maybe i'm on the lunatic fringe.

...some would say it's inconvenient to fuel up in the a.m. and is it really worth the effort....

...some would say that about Sabbath, too....

...sometimes the right thing is not convenient...

someone once said: "A penny saved is a penny earned" - so what's with gas being priced at 3.99 AND 9/10 ? Even 9/10 of a penny apparently adds up to quite a bit


Posted: 26 May 2008, 13:59
by Lambchop
Very well said Dawn. Every penny counts now days.

Chuck, once you have filled your gas tank, unless you have a hole in your tank, the gas doesn't evaporate when it heats up unless you open the gas cap and release the vapor which at that point the amount will drop sightly.
For example, we had a truck that had the clutch go out of it. The day it went out we had filled the gas tank. Then the truck got parked for about a year due to other problems it had.
Little by little it got fixed as time allowed and when we started it, how much gas would you guess was in the tank still? It was still full. Why? Nobody messed with opening the gas cap to release any vapors.
The only thing we did was add some gas additives to dry up the condensation that had built up over the year and the truck was good to go.
If you aren't a early bird, then fill up at night when the ground is cooling down. :)

Posted: 27 May 2008, 03:03
by chosen
HeHoldsMyHand wrote:Hey Chosen, that's a good idea! It IS a big car, but the swing doors make it draughty!

all you gotta do is close the doors!!! LOL!



Posted: 27 May 2008, 05:13
by chuckbaldwin
Lambchop wrote:Very well said Dawn. Every penny counts now days.

Chuck, once you have filled your gas tank, unless you have a hole in your tank, the gas doesn't evaporate when it heats up unless you open the gas cap and release the vapor which at that point the amount will drop sightly.
Hi Lambchop,

I didn't say 'evaporate'; i said 'expand'. Expansion was the reason given for buying gas early in the morning.

Here's another factor -- the cost of making that extra early-morning trip (assuming you would normally combine this trip with others, making it in effect shorter).
Let's assume your gas station is 2 miles from your house (mine is farther).
That's a 4-mile round trip. At 40 mpg (i get more; you probably get less), it would take 1/10 of a gallon to make the trip or (@ 4$/gal) 40 cents.

But gas isn't the only operating cost; there's maintenance, insurance, & depreciation.
At a conservative 25 cts/mile, the trip would cost an extra dollar.
If "every penny counts nowdays", then every DOLLAR counts even more.
So i think i'll just stay in bed a while longer, thank you. :D

Posted: 27 May 2008, 06:30
by Lambchop
LOL Okay lazy bones... The tank that the article is talking about is not your gas tank. It's the tank in the ground, that expands with heat. So filling up your car's gas tank won't expand and make it over flow.
Stay in bed and everybody please be quite and don't wake Chuck up as we tip toe out the door 8)

BTW Chuck, hows the oil in your lamp ??? :)