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Are you a person?

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Luneee
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Are you a person?

Postby Luneee » 14 Feb 2008, 15:42

Just a simple question:

Biblically, are you a person?

Shalom,

Jay Vincent.

Lambchop
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Postby Lambchop » 14 Feb 2008, 18:30

hee hee catchy question.... No I am not a trinitarian. :wink: Isn't this an english word?
Buy the truth and sell it not. Proverbs 23:23

Luneee
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Postby Luneee » 14 Feb 2008, 22:48

Lambchop wrote:hee hee catchy question.... No I am not a trinitarian. :wink: Isn't this an english word?


I am confused.

The question is "Biblically, are you a person?" How does "trinitarian" equate with "person?"

Shalom,

Jay Vincent.

Lambchop
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Postby Lambchop » 15 Feb 2008, 00:47

Never mind, bro. Jay. I've had my nose in the college books to long. :? I'm sorry, I took your question to mean something else. I'll come back down to earth now, and see if I can give you a answer.
:oops:
Goes to prove, never mix schooling and reading discussion forms, at the same time.....
Buy the truth and sell it not. Proverbs 23:23

eriqbenel
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Re: Are you a person?

Postby eriqbenel » 15 Feb 2008, 01:50

Luneee wrote:Just a simple question:

Biblically, are you a person?

Shalom,

Jay Vincent.


No. I am not a person Biblically. It is the government that makes me a person. As soon as I separate myself from the government system, I will no longer be a person.

I will be a man of YHWH, called, Eriq BenEl
Shalom in the name of YHWH,

Eriq

chuckbaldwin
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Postby chuckbaldwin » 20 Feb 2008, 04:50

Simple question, simple answer.

YES, I am a "person", according to the 4 main definitions i found:

Adam = man, mankind.
Ish = male, husband.
Enowsh = mortal man.
Nephesh = living being.

p.s. In case anyone thought i was dead, i'm not. I'm just inactive for a while.
Yahweh bless everyone.
Chuck Baldwin
By this shall all men know you are my disciples: if you have love one for another.

JMSchattke
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Postby JMSchattke » 20 Feb 2008, 11:17

What nonsense. Unless we have a computer program posting here, everyone is a person. Even the Angels/Malakim are persons.

I am a living soul. That's good enough for Yehvah.

I am not, as far as the silly lawyer talk goes, a "United States Person" - since I can't find a "United States" here in the Republic of Illinois. For that matter, I can't even find an "Illinois" in the current "State of Illinois."
Wandering Kernel of Happiness

eriqbenel
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Postby eriqbenel » 20 Feb 2008, 13:48

JMSchattke wrote:What nonsense. Unless we have a computer program posting here, everyone is a person. Even the Angels/Malakim are persons.

I am a living soul. That's good enough for Yehvah.

I am not, as far as the silly lawyer talk goes, a "United States Person" - since I can't find a "United States" here in the Republic of Illinois. For that matter, I can't even find an "Illinois" in the current "State of Illinois."



It's not nonsense. We should not be ignorant of Satans devices. The schemes and traps run wide and deep. But most of us have our heads stuck so far up the Beast's backside we can't see or hear.

A "person" legally or Scripturally is not a "human being". Being a person entitles the State to "ownership" of you. It is your registered name and number's.

Why do you think we have to have a birth certificate?
How is it that the State has the right to come and take your house, your land, even your children??!! Because they have "documents" of ownership of your person-hood. You and I, as a person, are slaves to them, and we cannot live, move and have our being without valid slave papers...
Shalom in the name of YHWH,



Eriq

JMSchattke
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Postby JMSchattke » 20 Feb 2008, 17:17

eriqbenel wrote:
JMSchattke wrote:What nonsense. Unless we have a computer program posting here, everyone is a person. Even the Angels/Malakim are persons.

I am a living soul. That's good enough for Yehvah.

I am not, as far as the silly lawyer talk goes, a "United States Person" - since I can't find a "United States" here in the Republic of Illinois. For that matter, I can't even find an "Illinois" in the current "State of Illinois."



It's not nonsense. We should not be ignorant of Satans devices. The schemes and traps run wide and deep. But most of us have our heads stuck so far up the Beast's backside we can't see or hear.


Man - humanity - is vested in the person.
[quote]American Heritage Dictionary - Cite This Source - Share This
per·son (pûr'sən) Pronunciation Key
n.
1. A living human. Often used in combination: chairperson; spokesperson; salesperson.
2. An individual of specified character: a person of importance.
3. The composite of characteristics that make up an individual personality; the self.
4. The living body of a human: searched the prisoner's person.
5. Physique and general appearance.
6. Law A human or organization with legal rights and duties.
7. Christianity Any of the three separate individualities of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, as distinguished from the essence of the Godhead that unites them.
8. Grammar
1. Any of three groups of pronoun forms with corresponding verb inflections that distinguish the speaker (first person), the individual addressed (second person), and the individual or thing spoken of (third person).
2. Any of the different forms or inflections expressing these distinctions.
9. A character or role, as in a play; a guise: "Well, in her person, I say I will not have you" (Shakespeare).

[i]Middle English, from Old French persone, from Latin persÅ
Wandering Kernel of Happiness

Luneee
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Postby Luneee » 20 Feb 2008, 18:38

JMSchattke wrote:What nonsense. Unless we have a computer program posting here, everyone is a person. Even the Angels/Malakim are persons.


Prove it by scripture.

JMSchattke wrote:I am a living soul. That's good enough for Yehvah.


That's not the question.


JMSchattke wrote:I am not, as far as the silly lawyer talk goes, a "United States Person" - since I can't find a "United States" here in the Republic of Illinois. For that matter, I can't even find an "Illinois" in the current "State of Illinois."



Job 32:21 Let me not, I pray you, accept any man's person, neither let me give flattering titles unto man.

Gal 2:6 But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person:) for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:

(KJV)

Luneee
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Postby Luneee » 20 Feb 2008, 18:56

JMSchattke wrote:Man - humanity - is vested in the person.


I'm waiting for proof of your claim, unless it is arbitrary.

JMSchattke wrote:The fact that Lawyers have created a legal fiction definition of "person" does not make you not a person. The fact that insane clerics have made up some crazy idea of three persons in one for the trinitarian nonsense does not make "person" be a less valid apelation to you, or me, or any other human.


What, then, makes YOU a person? (If that's what you claim to be.)


eriqbenel wrote:Why do you think we have to have a birth certificate?


I don't have a birth certificate. Do you? or do you just have a "certified" copy of one, that the State holds the original of?

Do you even know what a birth certificate is, or what law it invokes?

JMSchattke wrote:There was a reason I put in the cute caveat about the "United States Person" - but there is no way of escaping the fact that you are a person.


I'm still waiting for you to prove it.

JMSchattke wrote:Your hyperbolic sillyness is dangerous - people who have done real crimes and are caught will face he legal system, and the games you play will just make things more difficult. Judges might let you off on minor things because they would rather do that than consign you to an insane asylum for observation and deciding whether you are a danger to society.


Your language reveals your frustration (and lack of evidence to support your claims).

No one here is talking about crime, that I can see.

But, I'll wait for proof that I am a person. I consider the Scripture to be the only truth in the matter.

If this is sillyness and nonsense, copius proof should be at your fingertips, correct?

Jay Vincent.
Last edited by Luneee on 20 Feb 2008, 19:07, edited 2 times in total.

Luneee
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Postby Luneee » 20 Feb 2008, 19:03

chuckbaldwin wrote:Simple question, simple answer.

YES, I am a "person", according to the 4 main definitions i found:

Adam = man, mankind.
Ish = male, husband.
Enowsh = mortal man.
Nephesh = living being.

p.s. In case anyone thought i was dead, i'm not. I'm just inactive for a while.
Yahweh bless everyone.


Chuck, can you explain how you are a person from what you posted?

I do not understand how you came to believe you are a person from this material.

Thanks,

Jay Vincent.

JMSchattke
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Postby JMSchattke » 20 Feb 2008, 20:15

Luneee wrote:
JMSchattke wrote:What nonsense. Unless we have a computer program posting here, everyone is a person. Even the Angels/Malakim are persons.


Prove it by scripture.

This, on the face of it, is impossible, since "person" is english, to refer to a human being, and "scripture" was written in Hebrew or Greek. Hebrew and Greek, of course, don't use the English word "person." The words used in the context where an English speaking person might use person are:

(KJV)Lev 19:15 Ye shall do6213 no3808 unrighteousness5766 in judgment:4941 thou shalt not3808 respect5375 the person6440 of the poor,1800 nor3808 honor1921 the person6440 of the mighty:1419 but in righteousness6664 shalt thou judge8199 thy neighbor.5997
(TS98)Lev 19:15 'Do no unrighteousness in right-ruling. Do not be partial to the poor or favour the face of the great, but rightly rule your neighbour in righteousness.

See, the use of "person" changed over the years... in English. So The Scriptures used a different construction to achieve the same meaning.

Literally, "partial to the poor" is "lift face dangling" and "favor the face of the great" is "swell face great."

So, in the terms of the KJV here, yes, I am a "person" - I have a face (פני).

(KJV)Num 5:6 Speak1696 unto413 the children1121 of Israel,3478 When3588 a man376 or176 woman802 shall commit6213 any4480, 3605 sin2403 that men120 commit, to do4603 a trespass4604 against the LORD,3068 and that1931 person5315 be guilty;816
(TS98)Num 5:6 "Speak to the children of Yisra'ĕl, 'When a man or woman commits any sin that men commit in trespass against יהוה, and that being is guilty,

Literally, "that person be guilty" is "and-guilty the-breathing-animal the-he."

So, in the terms of the KJV here, yes, I am a person - I am a breathing animal (נפש×
Wandering Kernel of Happiness

Luneee
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Postby Luneee » 20 Feb 2008, 20:21

JMSchattke wrote:
Luneee wrote:
JMSchattke wrote:What nonsense. Unless we have a computer program posting here, everyone is a person. Even the Angels/Malakim are persons.


Prove it by scripture.

This, on the face of it, is impossible, since "person" is english, to refer to a human being, and "scripture" was written in Hebrew or Greek. Hebrew and Greek, of course, don't use the English word "person."


Thanks

Jay Vincent.

chuckbaldwin
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Location: East Ridge, TN

Postby chuckbaldwin » 20 Feb 2008, 20:43

Luneee wrote:
chuckbaldwin wrote:Simple question, simple answer.

YES, I am a "person", according to the 4 main definitions i found:

Adam = man, mankind.
Ish = male, husband.
Enowsh = mortal man.
Nephesh = living being.

p.s. In case anyone thought i was dead, i'm not. I'm just inactive for a while.
Yahweh bless everyone.


Chuck, can you explain how you are a person from what you posted?

I do not understand how you came to believe you are a person from this material.
I'm sorry, Jay. As usual my explanations are too short, and i assume people will understand them. Here's the longer version (but not THAT much longer):

With my "Online Bible" softward, i did a "word search" on the word "person*".
It found 107 verses.
I then displayed the Strong's numbers and looked up the words. The 4 most frequently used words were as follows:

#120 - Adam = man, mankind.
#376 - Iysh = male, husband.
#582 - Enowsh = mortal man.
#5315 - Nephesh = living being.

#6440 - Panyim = face: this also appeared a few times, and since JMS mentioned that having a "face" also makes one a "person", i'll add that one to the other 4.

Since i fit allof those definitions (except "husband"), i conclude that i'm a "person".
I hope that explains it better.
Chuck Baldwin

By this shall all men know you are my disciples: if you have love one for another.


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